First off, I must say that I don't think that the premise of BtVs is necessarily feminsist.
Agreed. I don't think Joss deliberately set out to create a feminist TV show or send a feminist message. I think, as penny_lane_42 said, he was more interested in subverting tropes, and the tropes he chose to subvert led to an unintentional feminist message. As the series went on, he embraced that reading, and made it explicit in season 7, but I don't think it was anything he was aiming for at the beginning, nor do I think he feels compelled to continue it, now that he's continuing the story.
But the reading was always there, and I think that's what's so disappointing for those who see her as a feminist icon. It wasn't something Joss built, but it was something they could take away from the text. It's been a lot harder to find something to take away from S8 where feminism is concerned. In fact, a lot of the messages (which again are probably unintentional, because Joss is STILL mainly concerned with subverting tropes) are downright scary from a feminist perspective.
I do think that, for a woman, acknowledging your personal sexuality, needs, likes and dislikes–– whether it's a powerful libido or a weaker one whatever–– instead of following what is expected from you by the others(especially those of the male category), is part of female empowerment.
That's a really good point, and not one I'd considered before.
If Angel is proven right in his belief that killing hundreds of Slayers is for the good it ruins the final metaphor of "Chosen" because Buffy's choice then becomes a mistake. If Angel is proven wrong, Buffy is a fool and still betrayed her sisters.
Either way we lose something precious, I think.
Yes. That's it exactly. Thanks for posting your thoughts!
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Agreed. I don't think Joss deliberately set out to create a feminist TV show or send a feminist message. I think, as
But the reading was always there, and I think that's what's so disappointing for those who see her as a feminist icon. It wasn't something Joss built, but it was something they could take away from the text. It's been a lot harder to find something to take away from S8 where feminism is concerned. In fact, a lot of the messages (which again are probably unintentional, because Joss is STILL mainly concerned with subverting tropes) are downright scary from a feminist perspective.
I do think that, for a woman, acknowledging your personal sexuality, needs, likes and dislikes–– whether it's a powerful libido or a weaker one whatever–– instead of following what is expected from you by the others(especially those of the male category), is part of female empowerment.
That's a really good point, and not one I'd considered before.
If Angel is proven right in his belief that killing hundreds of Slayers is for the good it ruins the final metaphor of "Chosen" because Buffy's choice then becomes a mistake. If Angel is proven wrong, Buffy is a fool and still betrayed her sisters.
Either way we lose something precious, I think.
Yes. That's it exactly. Thanks for posting your thoughts!