chani: (tahmoh dollhouse)
[personal profile] chani
There has been discussions on various places, including chez [livejournal.com profile] st_salieri  and chez [livejournal.com profile] enigmaticblues , about Dollhouse and the matter of misogyny and feminism.

Giving my two cents, I came to the conclusion that I rather have a marxist take on the series...which might change later since I have only seen two episodes! Anyway it's fun to ponder Joss' work even this early.

I can see how relevant certain critics are. As [livejournal.com profile] sister_luck  said in a previous thread, the show is basically ambiguous since it exposes a wrong behaviour while doing a similar thing with the lead actress, and with Tahmoh Penikett whose shirt disappeared after only a few seconds. And we are all the guilty clients here. Yes Echo has been showed dating and having sex with the clients of the Dollhouse, after and before getting her memory and personality wiped, which is quite a misogynistic fantasy, and yes Fox obviously sells the show on ED's good looks and hotness.


However I don't think that, in Joss' mind at least, "Dollhouse" is about women(or men), and the way they are treated and objectified even though the lead is a woman (something that has to do with Eliza Dusku being at the origins of the concept and being a producer...).
I guess that besides being a study on identity, "Dollhouse" has a very political side; it exposes the powerful ones,the mighty (here the organization providing dolls or the clients paying for them), and the horrible things they can do...just because they can; it's about what money can buy provided that you have the right technology at hands...ETA: this is why Joss when asked if the hsow concept weren't the ultimate misogynistic fantasy admitted if it wasn't untrue if it were"in the wrong hands".
 
Perhaps it's still all about power for Joss, except that he chose a new angle to tackle it.

Dolls like Echo, are both males and females; above all they are the victims of a system that can turn anyone vulnerable enough(for whatever reason, Caroline's past is yet to be revealed) into a slave. It's about man's exploitation of his kind. The feminist/misogynous angle should be pointless then.
 
Of course the system is flawed, even doomed to self-destroy because it creates the tools of its own destruction– here enters the Alpha's bloody storyline and Echo's slow growing into awareness that are going to screw the system. This might be the most Marxist element!

So when some viewers and critics see the Valley of the Dolls I see the upcoming Revolution of the Dolls. Perhaps it would have been more interesting and efficient if the lead weren't a female doll, if dolls were all supporting characters, so gender wouldn't be an issue here. The FBI agent should have been the lead.

Hey I can dream! :- )

But no, no the FBI guy can't be the lead from a marxist reading, this would be too wrong or too subversive, I am not sure. Besides he can't be the one bringing the Dollhouse down if I want to  keep my Marxist model. The dolls must rise and break their own chains. 

Now forget that FBI issue, my biggest problem would be the cancellation of the show. Now that would screw a Marxist reading. The Fox mighty would win then...

But it wouldn't be surprising; it's Hollywood, isn't it? Only Senator McCarthy once believed that there was such thing as Hollywood marxism.

Date: 2009-02-26 10:50 pm (UTC)
ext_15284: a wreath of lightning against a dark, stormy sky (Default)
From: [identity profile] stormwreath.livejournal.com
I'm inclined to agree with you. The whole concept behind Dollhouse, originally, was how being an actor deprives you of your own agency, because you're forever playing the roles other people give you. I bet that when Eliza Dushku meets random people on the street more of them address her as "Faith" than as "Eliza". Someone - I think it was [livejournal.com profile] aycheb - compared the Dollhouse to an old-fashioned Hollywood movie studio, with the actors under contract and completely at the beck and call of the producers. It's all about power, like you say.

As for the prostitution analogy, I think it's exactly that: a metaphor, NOT the whole point of the show. You can equally say that it's a critique of globalisation, and the belief that employees are completely interchangeable assets and can be fired and replaced by cheap contractors from India or Mexico with no repercussions. Why hire an actual expert when Dollhouse can program one up for you then wipe them again when you've finished with them? The prostitution analogy is there to say hey, maybe when the companies we work for do this to us, they're treating us like whores?*

* Although personally I'd recommend treating prostitutes respectfully as professional people offering a service, rather than as stereotypical "whores". :-)


From a practical perspective, of course they're going to show that Echo's engagements often involve sex. That's what every single person in the audience is going to assume anyway, so why play coy? And yes, the whole question of consent is a genuine controversy. But like you, I'm not sure that this is the only issue that the show wants to address...


This might be the most Marxist element!

I'm going to vote for this being the most blatant example of Marxist theory in the show:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_consciousness

:-)

Date: 2009-02-27 09:53 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] frenchani.livejournal.com
You can equally say that it's a critique of globalisation, and the belief that employees are completely interchangeable assets and can be fired and replaced by cheap contractors from India or Mexico with no repercussions. Why hire an actual expert when Dollhouse can program one up for you then wipe them again when you've finished with them?

Good one! People are even more disposable if they aren't real.

Date: 2009-02-27 07:09 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lijability.livejournal.com
I'm fairly well certain that this is nothing but a retelling of Buffy the Vampire Slayer in another setting and with differing parameters. The Watcher's created the Slayer, the Dollhouse and the Handler constantly remake their Dolls/Echo. The demons aren't those which one allegorically encounters as one grows up, but are those who more than likely hire the Dolls in to mimic real-life situations.

The one Dollhouse we see cannot be the full extent of the people/company behind Dollhouse. It may only be a splinter. I don't know how they're going to handle it but Echo has to become covertly subverted, likely by the FBI agent, but possibly lacking in recognition each time she sees him. Breaking free to become on her own, just as Buffy did, that is the path Echo is to be put upon. But how is she left after the Dollhouse falls (in season 4 if it gets that far?). LOL....
...

Date: 2009-02-27 07:12 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] lijability.livejournal.com
That lasts sentence should be: "But how is she to leave after the Dollhouse falls (in season 4 if it gets that far?)?"

Date: 2009-02-27 09:56 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] frenchani.livejournal.com
Authors tend to write the same thing over and over, don't they?

I think that Joss' obsession is the notion of power. Buffy was about female empowerment which isn't the main arc of Dollhouse, but it's still about power.

Date: 2009-02-27 06:43 pm (UTC)
ext_11565: (Default)
From: [identity profile] sister-luck.livejournal.com

I like your reading and I think it works well with what we've seen so far.

On the other hand, I think that Joss is well aware of the feminist implications of the Dollhouse concept and that he's walking a fine line there. As it happens so often, a lot of critics seem to conflate showing exploitation with an endorsement of this exploitation. An author sometimes shows something, highlighting its attractiveness, even though the author disapproves and I think that happened at the beginning of The Target: The young woman on a date in the woods is clearly enjoying herself, she is having fun and she is feeling happy and (which goes with your analysis) when the power balance shifts, the viewer becomes aware that the whole situation is highly unfair and that the odds are stacked against Echo. This realization is quite uncomfortable, too, because as a viewer we've been complicit in this exploitation.





Date: 2009-02-27 10:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] frenchani.livejournal.com
Now I see that some part of my post doesn't make sense! I quoted Joss ("in the wrong hands") answering an interview about the matter of misogyny in Dollhouse that I've discussed in someone else's journal but I forgot that I hadn't mentioned Joss' intervew in here.

The series is flawed and far from reaching the Buffy quality but it already provides food for thoughts!

Date: 2009-02-27 08:52 pm (UTC)
jerusha: (faith eb)
From: [personal profile] jerusha
This is a very interesting point, and I think a valid one. Looking at it from this perspective is likely to help me get over my "ick" factor when I watch it, as I'm sure I shall.

Date: 2009-02-27 10:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] frenchani.livejournal.com
Oh, it's just for fun. Joss' works always allow the viewers to parse, interpret and connect. Dollhouse isn't BTVS, far from it, but discussing what's behind the screen and trying to find redeemale qualities in the writing feels like old times with Buffy.

I remember how underwelmed and disappointed I was with "Chosen" when it aired (mostly because I found it showy with too many special effects), and how I made myself enjoy the show ending and its metaphors just by discussing the episode on a forum of fans and by writing essays on it!

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